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much likedMiklosMale
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Alchemy laboratory, essences
1. post - 2012.06.18. 12:25:54
I would like to explain in more detail how the alchemy laboratory (a clan building) works.

There are 5 basic essence categories. Space-time, Loyalty, Combat, Life and Special.



How to get essences
1. Whenever you squeeze a pet for soul-energy you have a 10% chance to receive a random essence. You can increase this chance to 15% by developing the Alchemist AA ability.
2. If you give a gradulatum (pet equipment, sold at soul-huckster) of the appropriate type to a pet, you will receive an essence with 100% chance. The pet must be trained! If the pet's level is at least 20, you get 2 essences, if it's at least 40, you get 3 etc. Essence anomaly (purchased for temple crystals) increases this by 1. he Alchemist AA ability also gives chance to get an additional essence.
3. You can also use APts and DPts on the Alchemy laboratory page to get essences. If you use a gradulatum as well you can specifiy the type and your chance will be 100%.
4. There is also a chance to win essence in events like the Wheel of Fortune.

How to use essences
1. Most essences give a temporal skill boost. To use an essence simply use it on the skill page with the red cross button next to the skill name. Some essences can be used from the alchemy laboratory page instead. Some others, like resurrection, are used when a specific situation arises.
2. You can also use essences to create ultraessences (see below).

Ultraessences
On the Alchemy laboratory page, you can create Ultraessences when the laboratory's level is at least 25. To do so, you need 5 different essences of one given category (like Space-Time, Life etc) and a Catalyst essence (under Special category). As you can see, to get a Special Ultraessence you will need a total of 2 Catalyst essences.
Ultraessences are colored green. They can be used as common essences, or can be combined into a megaessence.

Megaessences
To create a Megaessence, you need a level 50 Alchemy Laboratory and 5 different ultraessences.
Megaessences are permanent abilities to your character, like decreasing the cost of training pets, decreasing the cost of improving abilities and skills etc. The megaessences you own are listed on the Alchemy lab page. If you quit your clan, your Megaessences will become inactive but you do not lose them.
You can do the first 15 Megaessences this way. To create more, you need Catalyzed essences.

Catalyzed essences
Megaessence 14 gives you the power to find Exceptional essences. This is a 6th category besides Life, Combat etc. Whenever you use a normal essence (not when combining them, only when using them!) you will have 33% chance to find a random Exceptional essence. Excepcional essences are very powerful, and colored in yellow.
As with other essences, you can do 2 things with Exceptional essences. You can either use them, or if you have 5 different, you can combine them with the use of a catalyst essence into a Catalyzed essence.
Catalyzed essences are necessary to get more than 15 Megaessences. Catalyzed essences are not used up on the process, they will remain on your character page. For every 5 Megaessences above 15, you need an additional Catalyzed essence. So to have 20 Megaessences, you need 1, to have 25, you need 2, for 30, you need 3, and for 35, you need a total of 4. Currently this is the maximum number of Megaessences but we will add more later.
This post was modified by Miklos at 2012.06.18. 12:30:41
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popularSbartMale

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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
2. post - 2012.06.18. 13:45:10 (Reply to post #1 of Miklos.)
Quote: Miklos - 2012.06.18. 12:25:54
I would like to explain in more detail how the alchemy laboratory (a clan building) works.

<snip>
How to get essences
1. Whenever you squeeze a pet for soul-energy you have a 10% chance to receive a random essence. You can increase this chance to 15% by developing the Alchemist AA ability.
<snip>


I wonder i this is actually how the AA ability work, because when we (in the Clan) discussed it, it looked more like it worked like a separate 5% chance of finding an essence. One of the reason for this "feeling" is that if you have the Alchemist AA ability you can sometimes find 2 essences when squeezing (a non-trained pet). Could you please check with the programmer if it actually an addition to the normal chance, or a separate chance?
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popularrzagos

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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
3. post - 2012.06.19. 00:39:29 (Reply to post #2 of Sbart.)
I think Miklos answerred that with point 2. <snip> Alchemist AA ability also gives chance to get an additional essence <snip>

So the AA ability increases your chances to 15% to find (an) essence(s) but also gives an x% chance that the number of essence(s) found is increased by 1.
This post was modified by rzagos at 2012.06.19. 00:43:26
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much likedMiklosMale
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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
4. post - 2012.06.20. 12:49:07 (Reply to post #2 of Sbart.)
Quote: Sbart - 2012.06.18. 13:45:10
if you have the Alchemist AA ability you can sometimes find 2 essences when squeezing (a non-trained pet). Could you please check with the programmer if it actually an addition to the normal chance, or a separate chance?


I asked the programmer, and he told me that is is simply 15% chance. So if you ever found 2 essences from an untrained pet, it is a bug. So are you sure about this that someone found 2 essences?
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popularSbartMale

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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
5. post - 2012.06.20. 13:56:56 (Reply to post #4 of Miklos.)
I do not have any screen shots of it, but I am pretty sure that I have seen 2 essences from one pet (and even 3 from squeezing a level 20 pet).

But you do say that the Alchemist ability gives a chance to get an extra essence, so that would explain it.
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averagesenner

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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
6. post - 2012.06.24. 09:39:11 (Reply to post #1 of Miklos.)
Hi,

Thanks for the post

I have a question about the rewards; I have collected 22 bonuses, is it possible to complete the list and provide the description of the bonuses from nr 23 on?

You extra bonuses:

1.) From now all your pets skill maximum increased by 10.
2.) Pet training time is halved, it's SE cost is reduced by 25%.
3.) Increasing abilities costs 1% less.
4.) +3% SE for hunt (does not stack with Tower of Power).
5.) Increasing skills costs 1% less.
6.) From now on, each of your pets max. skill points is increased by 10.
7.) Developing your luck is 2% more effective
8.) Your pets morale decreases slower (equivalent of approx. +15 charisma)
9.) You get 5% more AA points.
10.) From now on, each of your pets max. skill points is increased by 10.
11.) The maximum of yout intelligent pet skill is increased by 5.
12.) The cost of training a pet decreases by 50% instead of 25%.
13.) You get+3% bonus to your hunts instead of +5% SE. (Does not stack with Tower of Power bonus)
14.) If you use a non-special essence, there is a chance that you find a special essence.
15.) From now on, each of your pets max. skill points is increased by 10.
16.) You get an additional 5% bonus to your AA points.
17.) The bonus to increase your abilities is now 2% instead of 1%.
18.) The bonus to increase your skills is now 2% instead of 1%.
19.) The bonus to increase your luck is now 4% instead of 2%.
20.) From now on, each of your pets max. skill points is increased by 10.
21.) The efficiency of jealing your pets is increased by 50%.
22.) The maximum of your trade skill is increased by 20.


In the post you mentioned that for 35 Megaessences, you need a total of 4 Catalyzed essence, so a lot bonuses to come i guess

Thanx in advance,
Senner
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very popularMatdavMale

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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
7. post - 2012.06.24. 10:02:55 (Reply to post #6 of senner.)
23.) The maximum of your soul-energy squeezing skill is increased by 5.
24.) The bonus to increase your luck is now 6% instead of 4%.
25.) From now on, each of your pets max. skill points is increased by 10.
26.) Your magic absorption is increased by 100.
27.) The maximum of your shape reality skill is increased by 5.
28.) The bonus to increase your abilities is now 3% instead of 2%.
29.) The bonus to increase your skills is now 3% instead of 2%.
30.) From now on, each of your pets max. skill points is increased by 10.
31.) You get+8% bonus to your hunts instead of +5% SE. (Does not stack with Tower of Power bonus)
32.) You get an additional 5% bonus to your AA points.
33.) The chance to find a special essence will increase from 33% to 50%.
34.) The bonus to increase your luck is now 8% instead of 6%.
35.) From now on, each of your pets max. skill points is increased by 10.
W1 - Spellcaster - (inactive)
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averagesenner

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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
8. post - 2012.06.26. 09:21:35 (Reply to post #7 of Matdav.)
Cool, thanks
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averageTrackur

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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
9. post - 2012.08.06. 16:03:23
So after you guys reviewed the Alchemy lab stuff and made this post you changed the rate at which the essences drop. Each group has 1 rare essence that now NEVER drops.
I used to get 2-3 of a couple of each of the other 4 before the 1 rare dropped and I could make a mega.
Now I have 6 of each of the other 4 in every group and the 1 rare WONT DROP! Is it becasue you are greedy and want us to spend all those diamonds on harnesses? I am so frustrated that I doint care to try anymore so that doesnt work. If it's about the money then make a harness for 10SD that I can choose what essence I want! I'll buy 50 of em.

If not then CHANGE THE RANDOM BACK, it's so frustrating to squeeze 18 pets in a row and keep getting the same 4 essesences and not teh 5th one that you CAN'T GET!
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much likedMiklosMale
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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
10. post - 2012.08.06. 16:26:53 (Reply to post #9 of Trackur.)
Hi Trackur,
We never changed essence drop rates since we introduced the Alchemy lab. Each group has 5 basic essences, there are no common or rare essences, each has the same chance to drop. I'm very sorry to hear you were unlucky with finding some. We are planning to add a way to help people with extremely bad luck, adding and effect which can convert essences.
Please ask around in the game, you will see that the essences you consider rare, is the essence of which others have a huge surplus. It's just luck. And eventually, you will find the missing essences.
Miklos
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averageTrackur

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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
11. post - 2012.08.06. 16:50:16
That is such a lie! why is then, that have 6 of each type of essence in every group except 1 that is always rare? if they had the same chance then I wouldn't get so many of the same 4 and NEVER get the one I need.
The facts are there, they do not have the same chance no matter what you might say. If they are supposed to have the same chance then there is a mistake somewhere in the programming.


Thanks for the swift responce.

Edit: Similar to Essence converter, there could be something that takes 4 like essences in a group to create of of your choice.
This post was modified by Trackur at 2012.08.06. 17:15:49
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much likedMiklosMale
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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
12. post - 2012.08.07. 12:20:52
Dear Trackur,
It's just mathematics.
Let's say we roll with a dice 18 times. You would expect that you will roll 3 x 1, 3 x 2, 3 x 3 etc. But that is not the case. There will be numbers you roll more and some you will roll less. It is quite possible, that out of 18 rolls, there will be a number which you never roll:
There is 5/6 chance that you do not roll 1 on first roll, 5/6 that you do not roll on 2nd, etc. so it is 5/6*5/6*...*5/6= 3.7% chance that you do not roll 1 out of 18 rolls.
Same for 2s, 3s. etc, so there is 6*3.7% = 22.2% chance that out of 18 rolls there will be a number you don't roll at all. (Ok, this is a bit simplified, because there are cases which we counted multiple times, like when you roll no 1s neither 2s, so the chance is a bit less).

About essences. Following the above example, If you got 15 essences of the same group, there is 17.5% chance that you do not find one specific. With 20, the chance is only 5.5%.

Also I found the program code for you which chooses the essence to be found:

$talalt_esszencia=$sima_esszenciak[rand(0,count($sima_esszenciak)-1)];


As you see, there is no distinction between rare and common, its just a plain random with equal chances.

The good news is, if you continue collecting the essences, eventually you will have them. I'm sorry for your bad luck, and I hope you will get the essences you need soon.
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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
13. post - 2012.08.31. 05:10:12 (Reply to post #12 of Miklos.)
I am also starting to think there is something wrong with this formula Miklós.
I have been trying to get all 5 essences from the Space-Time group and in the past 22(!) pet squeezes, I haven't found any CA+5. This is very very very unlikely if all essences have a 20% drop chance.

Cruel.
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likedDolp13

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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
14. post - 2012.08.31. 22:33:40 (Reply to post #13 of Cruel01.)
I have often wondered the same thing with this game. Another one that puzzles me is the 7 items quest. When I do 25 DG monsters, I get around 10-13 items. When I do the 7 items quest, it usually takes 20-27 DG battles. Puzzling.
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much likedMiklosMale
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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
15. post - 2012.09.01. 15:39:43 (Reply to post #14 of Dolp13.)
Believe me, it is pure random. I play a character on the original servers, I tried several times the 7 items quest, but it always took me more than 25 DG, so since that I do the 25 DG instead. I suggest you to do the same, if you don't want to risk, walk the safe path. But you should be aware that if you like to take risks, probably you are better off with the 7 items quest (if your luck is high enough) because then it takes only 21-22 DG on average to find it.

Cruel, about the essences, keep trying, chance for each essence is the same.
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averageTrackur

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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
16. post - 2012.09.04. 15:56:08
When you create an ultra essence from combat essences you get an ultra essence that add +40 to your toughness.. I have the belt of toughness so my skill level is 100. if I use and essence and have 140 toughness I will I get ANOTHER attack as well?

P.S. the chance to get an essence is not random!
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popularSbartMale

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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
17. post - 2012.09.04. 16:05:21
Just out of curiosity; What kind of random number generator does Beholder use for Doomlord?
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much likedMiklosMale
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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
18. post - 2012.09.05. 14:00:19 (Reply to post #16 of Trackur.)
No, you will not get more attacks from the toughness essence if you already have a belt of toughness.

Our programmer uses the php's built in random function (see as an example in the above program code I quoted). And trust me it works correctly, we did a quadrillion of testing...
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averageTrackur

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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
19. post - 2012.09.05. 16:34:59
test it some more... what is the chance for getting a 20% chance item 8 times in a row? I will tell you. is 0.001% chance of happening. yet, it happens every time! happens to my clan mates too. and in Cruel01's case of NOT getting that 20% chance in 22 tries? he shoudl have gotten roughly 5. maybe 2-3 or 6-7. but not 0.
I have 24 bonuses and I did the first 18 in the same time it took to do the last 6. It's very frustrating to say the least.
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averageTrackur

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Re: Alchemy laboratory, essences
20. post - 2012.09.15. 16:10:16
Life

6 building (+5)
6 detect traps (+20)
11 thievery (+20)
6 pick locks (+20

I had 2 or 3 of each 16 essences ago!!! We need that item that can covert 4 of teh same essence into another one from that group. becasue this is a bunch of crap and it didnt used to be this difficult.
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